Is all that is opinion or perspective about truth (and universal Truth is lost)? With examples like moral truth, family values, and education, ARE ALL TRUTHS opinion/REVISABLE/EMPIRICAL OR innate/METAPHYSICAL, AS WITH our decisions about why we do what we do, i.e. not kill each other, go to school etc.
The question is -- Why do we (people) all seem to go along with what we are told (go to school, work a regular 9 to 5 job, not be cannibals) if the power to choose is based in our own opinions? (Why don't more people act more randomly or individualistically?)
Are we all simply victims of cultural and paternal influence and lemmings to those dictates and therefore conform or is there another reason for the continuity we see in people's actions?
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People do have their own choice in what to do, but still their actions aren't totally random and individual. People are in a sense lemmings, as they always take into account other people's opinions and water down their own ideas to match other people's ideas. People do have individuality, but the only things they express it in are irrelevant, because culture has a big say in relevant, important aspects of life. This prevents major random actions from occurring, but allows tiny rebellions of individualism. Not many people are exempt from culture enough to decide to amass huge wealth and then buy or make a small Pacific island and make their own country.
ReplyDeleteAnother way culture controls us is that it gives us choices of what to do, but the choices are all limited. (Ex. 'Would you like ham or turkey on your sandwich?' instead of 'Do you want a sandwich')
When people decide not to kill other people, it isn't because they don't want to, it is because they will be better off if they don't, due to the influences of culture. Many people are pragmatists this way, and the main reason behind their actions is self-interest. Since cultural conditions/ethics differ little from place to place (murder is wrong everywhere), people respond similarly to their environment. They have free will, but find it easier to be a lemming than to be independent, because the lemmings make the laws for everyone to follow (and base them off of lemming principles), even the non-lemmings.
Simply put, being a sheep is easy. It is easy to go along with the crowd, to conform to things that bring individuals happiness. Having a path to follow for some things in life is not a bad thing. Hearing others opinions of products, what movies to see and which to avoid. What alcohol is best to use to get trashed. All these things, though petty, are sheep bait. They help citizens follow the crowd, and (shock) be happy with their decisions. Every individual chooses their own career and who they love not because they are lemmings, but because they want to choose these things.
ReplyDeleteYes, we are sheep when it comes to the smaller things in life. But in the grand scheme of things, humans determine their own paths, just take small detours from time to time to get their quicker.
As humans, many times we do choose to conform to society in regards to culture and society, because in our lives it is simpler to go through a path that many have already taken. The process of going to school, going to college, and pursuing a nine-to-five career has shown success for a large percentage of people who have followed this path. Therefore, many people who want success look to this method because of its proven success. Honestly, it is much easier to become a success by following how someone else did it rather than try and fail on your own.
ReplyDeleteBut for the people who choose not to conform there are benefits. Musicians, artists, and people who create their own fields of study with new technology are usually people who do not follow the social monotony of the "normal life." But because most people go down this path which much less success, people are afraid to be individualistic in their actions.
The fear of failure is a strong power for many people to want to go through life the way of the conformist, simply because it logically does seem like the better chance for a successful life. And, as the people who live this "conforming life" do follow the regular ethical standards, it leads the people who want to follow in their footsteps to do the same. This shows why many people choose to conform to the ideas of the "normal" social and cultural code.
(Now this does not neccessarily mean that people who do not try to follow the path of the conformist cannot agree with the code social and cultural ethics, but they usually do not choose to blindly follow it as the conformers would. Many of the ethical standards of the world are based on Moral Truths, which is why even the nonconformists believe in certain parts of the ethical code.)
Call it a watered-down form of Social Darwinism, but for me, people accept what others tell them to do or not to do, because it is in the interest of the survival of society. In order for society to exist harmoniously, to progress in any way whatsoever (be it materialistically, technologically, spiritually, growing towards lasting peace, etcetera), an absolute Truth MUST be accepted by society. Even though it may be romantic for intellectuals to claim that there is no one Truth to the universe, but only a collection of equally plausible perspectives and thus give each individual more unique value, I would boldly wager that deep down, most people realize that this interpretation is extremely dangerous and threatening to the foundation of the global society.
ReplyDeleteAs an example, consider JBAHR's observation that "murder is wrong everywhere." He confidently asserted this because it is what most of the world accepts as a Universal Truth. However, not every individual and group has accepted this Truth throughout history, nor in the present day. For instance, in Nazis Germany, Hitler and his followers had the personal perspective that killing Jews and other minorities was the right, even moral, thing to do, because it would benefit their own agendas. In fact, extermination for these minorities was popularly interpreted as a patriotic endeavor, in some cases, that it was even God's Will. In short, the Nazis passionately and sincerely disagreed with the statement that "murder is always wrong." This scenario pays tribute to the danger of individuals following personal perspective as opposed to a Universal Truth. The Nazis' actions led to the Holocaust, which, because it led to the deaths of some 12 million innocent people, is remembered as one of the darkest hours of civilization. The result of the atrocities was absolute chaos, because people could not trust their own government, individuals turned against their fellow humans, etcetera. Needless to say, little, if any, valuable spiritual progress was made during this era by the people obsessed with killing innoccent civilians. In other words, when personal perspective is allowed to dominate the accepted Universl Truth, there is no way to guide society, or keep it on the "straight and narrow path," and society's foundation is at risk of being torn to pieces by its own people.
With the (perhaps subconscious) understanding of the dangers involved in overriding the Truth, individuals generally take it upon themselves to conform to the social norms of morality. In that sense, perhaps the purpose of all people in life is to live every day so that they become a step closer to accepting the Truth; the goal of life is for people to overcome their perspective which may lead them to act selfishly and harm others, to make room for that Universl Truth. Therefore, individuals nobly make choices that adhere to what society dictates is right and wrong, placing themselves not as an independent authority, but rather as a part of a larger puzzle, with the responsibility of ensuring the survival of that puzzle. In that sense, a key to the concept of the Universal Truth is that it does not need any proof or explanation. Rather, people simply take it upon themselves to abide by its authority because it has proven through the ages to provide certainty, comfort, and harmony for society as a whole.
I have a couple ideas as to why people go along with these things, not sure which has the most influence nor am I sure how one would go about proving these things but whatever, here they are:
ReplyDelete1. People are told what to do for most of their life and simply accept it and don't really think about what else to do and are kind of aimless. I think this quote from Fight Club sums up this sense of aimlessness pretty well:
"My father never went to college so it was really important I go to college. After college, I called him long distance and said, now what? My dad didn't know, so he said get a job. When I got a job and turned twenty-five, long distance, I said, now what? My dad didn't know, so he said, get married. I'm a thirty-year-old boy, and I'm wondering if another woman is really the answer I need."
People just accept it and go along with everything for most of their lives and by then they might feel like it's too late to change anything.
2. People don't accept it but feel like something is going to change eventually, they feel like something is going to come along and they'll find meaning in their life, whatever. Again, I'll quote from a movie, this time Synecdoche New York:
"While alive, you wait in vain, wasting years, for a phone call or a letter or a look from someone or something to make it all right. And it never comes or it seems to but it doesn't really. And so you spend your time in vague regret or vaguer hope that something good will come along."
People put up with all this boring daily routine with the hope that something better will come along, and who knows, maybe it will, maybe not.
I dunno, just watch those movies, or re-read the quotes I posted, they kind of sum up what I'm trying to say better than I can.
-Chris Felton
I agree with dave about the ease and commanness of being sheep. Working 9-5 and staying under the radar and unbothered is the dream of many. The other side of it is the people who want to stand out and be diffferent, that is where the other group of non conformers exist.
ReplyDeleteThe desire to be differen or better than the rest or be an individual or to break away from the pack is in most humans. While again like dave said the little things are often followed in a sheep-like fashion, but on bigger scales is where you see bigger variation and more individualism.
The cannibal degree is messed up and those people are dealt with accordingly (jail). But the people who are individuals and not strict followers make life interesting and the world work the way it does. Life would be boring without these people..... Even the cannibals add a little exitement
Will we survive for long if we act impulsively and randomly? No. People have the tendency to choose what is worst for them. You are more likely to be gunned down if you start acting randomly than if you act 'normal'.
ReplyDeleteDoing what is expected of us is a matter of survival. We do jobs because we get paid, and we need money to buy our everyday items, which we need (or so we think) to live.
We know that if we act crazy, we stand out, and the people who stand out get taken down first. Which is why we try to blend in. We want to live and survive peacefully.
Killing randomly or eating people will earn you a trip to jail, an insane asylum, or a grave. It's either that or a normal life. And I think we know which one people tend to chose the most.
Individualism in a society where social norms are what they are, essentially is being conformist and non-conformist at the same time. People are influenced by the ones around them to think and act a certain way from a young age. To rebel against a social norm is cause for chaos; if looked at from a certain angle, our world today is a dystopian society.
ReplyDeleteWhile our dystopia may not be as severe as that of George Orwell's "1984", Margaret Atwood's "Handmaid's Tale", or (a real world example) North Korea, we are still controlled by the things/people around us. Normalcy has no set definition, nothing that tells us what is and what isn't, what should and what shouldn't be. In essence, our ideas of normalcy stem from safety and survival. As Tony said, "We want to live and survive peacefully."
People can think however they may wish to, yet the moment they act out against what is considered to be "normal", here comes chaos... oh, and the government.
People definitely form their own identities through their influences. Parents and friends are particularly strong influences in a young adult's life. Genes are one way parents help create their child's identity, but also their choices and views. Having parents that smoke makes the probability of the child smoking later in life go up. The same is true for other things that are not as visible. Racism and political views are also statistically shown to be passed down by parents. Friends also influence people. "Peer pressure" is real, and is the reason many kids willingly choose to make some bad decisions that wouldn't normally have been chosen (along with good decisions, too).
ReplyDeletePeople choose to conform to their own culture for a multitude of reasons, but they all link back to the brain. Psychological forces are what move people to make choices on clothes and beliefs. People make choices in their brains, and the brain processes the information it receives differently with different people. But because people are all human beings, we all have the basic instinct to "fit in". Other primates like chimpanzees live in groups, not as loners, because it is in their brains and genetic makeup. It is the same with humans. It is for this reason that I agree with Dan R above. He wrote that people make choices due to the need for society to survive. This is a definite effect of the human need for group interaction. One must remember that humans are in fact another species of animal whose instinctual will to survive and reproduce outweighs everything else. Survival for humans depends on the survival of society, and this is why most humans conform to society instead of attempting to be nonconformist.
Free will allows people to do what they please and see fitting for the situation. The environment which one is immersed in aids in determining morals and ethics which are the explanation for why people do what they do. From a young age indoctrination is put upon people and although this isn’t an actual statistic, most people lead their lives based on the morality that is developed based on by their surroundings. When people deviate from what society has deemed as acceptable they are usually ridiculed, ostracized or considered crazy. Examples of this are homicide, rape, being a cannibal.
ReplyDeleteUnless you deviate from the socially acceptable you are a lemming to society. It’s like the hippies from the 70’s said “The man” is keeping you down. Whether people know it or not they enjoy conformity and tend to not deviate from the socially acceptable. Even those who claim to dislike “fitting in” or conforming are in fact conforming with others who like them ‘don’t want to conform’. People who are considered practical and have conformed to society are lemmings. Being a lemming isn’t necessarily a bad thing though. If people didn’t obey laws simply because they have free will, society would be crazy because people have different morals. Like Daniel R said “people simply take it upon themselves to abide by its authority because it has proven through the ages to provide certainty, comfort, and harmony for society as a whole.”
To a degree, yes, I do think we could all be called lemmings. But in this case, what’s wrong with that? We’ve found a comfortable lifestyle as a society that efficiently keeps order and aims to make people happy. And in the places where people aren’t happy, they revolt and try to change their lifestyle. People live within the confines of their jobs because they’ve been taught that it works, and they’ve been taught to like it. I think Dave put it well when describing the ease of our current life. Society may be/is our Big Brother watching over us, but that’s how we like it. (Just take the founding of the US for an example. This newfound country could virtually be organized in any manner, but the founding fathers chose to use some structure because their individual perspectives told them that structure was to an extent, vital.)
ReplyDeleteSo if we’re all lemmings, does that mean none of us are lemmings?
I think that if people were in fact following some inherent metaphysical Truth subconsciously, then we would be considered even more like a group of “lemmings”. If everyone’s just going along with what a higher power dictated, then there would be much less random action. True, we tend to live pretty static lives, but maybe that’s just because all of our own perspective truths just align (for the most part) with others’. If a large group of people believe in the same truth, does that necessarily make it universal? I don’t believe it does. All it does is add a little bit of harmony to the world.
I think the greatest example of the lemming phenomena in media is Fight Club. The movie/book is chock full of ways the modern man is dictated by society, and in turn the ways modern man can fruitlessly rebel against society. Chris Felton already posted a really good quote from it, but here’s another that I wanted to share.
"Like everyone else, I had become a slave to the IKEA nesting instinct. If I saw something clever like a coffee table in the shape of a yin and yang, I had to have it. I would flip through catalogs and wonder, "What kind of dining set defines me as a person?" We used to read pornography. Now it was the Horchow Collection. I had it all. Even the glass dishes with tiny bubbles and imperfections, proof they were crafted by the honest, simple, hard-working indigenous peoples of...wherever."
Fight Club is an awesome movie. It actually has a lot to do with perspective and philosophy.
ReplyDeleteEveryone's actions are determined by secular experiences. When a child is young the child must be told how to act. "Don't touch the hot iron it will burn you." However, the child will touch it because of curiosity and will get burned. The parental figure will say no don't do that again and because the child got hurt because of it will listen to the parent's wisdom that possibly was gained by the same experience. Being told what to do will not have any affect on the actions of a child who has not gone through any experience. If a child is shoved in a box for the first twenty years of their life not allowed to be exposed to the dangers of the outside world. Now if this twenty year old is exposed to the same hot iron experience as the one year old is will go through the same experience because the mind of the twenty year old is more developed but less knowledgable than that of the one year old.
ReplyDeleteThe human race is based on expeerience, one thousand deaths are the experience on peson needs to live. The human in today's society follows what his or her predecessors found out that would work without this sort of lemming characteristic we all would be doing different things and it would not work because if one person died jumping off a cliff no one would learn not to go near a cliff. Our "follow what works" characteristic is what keeps our etire race alive.
As for our opinions however, the same basic principle applies. President George Bush didn't do such a great job in the eyes of americans therefore people realized that it was not a good experiece like the hot iron. Therefore we voted in Obama because he ran against the George Bush idealogy. Now some people are realizing that Obama might not be the best idea either and therefore, in the 2012 election the other candidate may take the office over Obama.
Who knows for sure if my ideas are correct but from my observations it seems that if one person is affected negatively by a leader that person will become biased toward the other side while if another is profiting from the other's misfortune that person will want to continue to profit and will support someone who takes the same side.